"MSV CLUB" - The Discussion Forum of MSVTimes.com

[ragasuda]

I always doubted that one song from the film Periya Idathu Penn stands out separately. The style, the rhythm, the voice culture, every thing stood different. The song is "Thulli Odum Kaalgalenge", sung by TMS and P. Sushila. Even the bgm sounded different. I was of the opinion that this song must have been the sole product of MSV. After about 10 years of this film's first release, another song cleared my doubt. Yes, it was Nilavu Oru Pennagi from Ulagam Sutrum Vaaliban. I still believe this is a single handed composiotion by Mellisai Mannar and served as a predecessor to what lied in store in future.

To satisfy myself, I tried on the mixing of these two songs in audio and the resultant mp3 file is provided at the following link.

http://www.esnips.com/doc/ebf60c0a-c466-4f20-92b9-85500a1524c7/ThulliOdumNilavuOrumix

Please let me have your feedback.

Raghavendran
_________________
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[parthavi]

Dear Mr. Raghavendran,

An interesting mix. My observations are :

1) For a long time, I believed that TKR should have made some contribution to the songs of VR. But of late, I feel that every song of VR not only hasthe soul of MSV but is a solo effort as well. TKR's contribution might have been only in arrangement. Anyway, this has been a much debated topic and there is no way of reaching a conclusive decision. I heard TKR saying in his speech during 'Vadhdhiyangal sollum varththaigal' "MSV will say I was his guide. But I just remained with him." I think this was a statement from his heart, not a formal humble statement.

2) I also find similarities in several songs. A line or BGM in a song will lead to another song. I do not have the patience or expertise to demonstrate this using the audios, except in person. Yesterday I was listening to 'Paalaabhishekam seyyavo?" from Muthtthaana Muththallavo and the saranam reminded me of some other song. After some reflection, I realized that the saranam is exactly similar to that of the song 'Manmadha leelai, mayakkudhu aalai.'

I have observed several similarities, some of which I list below;

a) Mullil roja - At the end of the saranam, you can go to Thaththai nenjam smoothly. At the end of the first interlude, you can deviate to Kettavarellaam paadalaam. The interlude itself is similar to that of Kanni venduma. The interlude also has the same tune as 'ilai maraiththoru pazham pazhuththadhu' of 'maanendru pennukkoru pattam koduththaan' from Anubhavi Raja Anubhavi.

b) 'unnai adaintha manam vaazhga' from Anandhi has links to 'siriththaal thangap padhumai' 'kangalum kaavadich chinthaagattum' and 'thanneerle thaamaraipoo.' When I had been to Mr. Sampath's place (more than a year back), I mentioned this to him and by playing the lines on the keyboard, he concurred with me that there was a similarity of chords. This made me feel that I was not imagining things.

c) 'Aayiram kannukku virundhaagum' has links to 'kannan varuvaan' and 'mella varum kaatru.'

d) There are other songs, which are similar throughout. 'kannangaruththa kili' from Sivagangaichcheemai, if played at a slower pace will have the same tune as ''panaththottam podumendru.' I had written about this earlier in the forum and in response, one of the members pointed out that 'engeyum eppodhum' also has a similarity to another song (which I don't remember.) But this category of songs may be different in the sense that composers sometimes use the same tune with some minor alterations. But the other examples I have given above, have similarities in parts. It is like going to a website, clicking a link you find there and arriving at another site!

What intrigues me is whether these similarities happen unconsciously or whether MM has some templates (which he stores in his mind, of course) and uses them whenever he wants. Perhaps, there is a musical significance for these similarities. But this can be deciphered only people with music knowledge. Regrettably, I am not one.
_________________
P Rengaswami (9381409380)
MSV, Un isai kettaal puvi asainthaadum, idhu iraivan arul aagum.
http://msv-music.blogspot.in/

[parthavi]

Another astonishing similarity is the similarity of the interludes of 'Naanamo innum naanamo' from Aayiraththil oruvan and 'kangaley kaathal seyvathai vittu vidungal' from Vaazhkkaip padagu. Though the first song has a mode of ecstacy and the second one of frustration and anger, MM has used an interlude with almost the same notes (tune) but has shown the difference in mood by the choice of instruments, variation of emphasis and other adjustmnts. This kind of coincidence is puzzling to me. When composing 'kangale,' did he recall the interlude of 'naanamo' and decide to use the same for this song with a different effect? I will be thankful for any enlightening explanations/suggestions.
_________________
P Rengaswami (9381409380)
MSV, Un isai kettaal puvi asainthaadum, idhu iraivan arul aagum.
http://msv-music.blogspot.in/

[madhuraman]

Dear Mr. Parthavi,
"vAzhkai padagu" was earlier to "100O il oruvan". So, 'nANamO' must have been composed later. The inspiration perhaps was the otherway round. A simple clue would help."1000 IL oruvan was the last movie for MSV -TKR. Though my clarification can not modify your observation on similarities between interludes, it is a polite indicator to suggest the lead thought and the one that was subsequently derived.
Warm regards. K.Raman Madurai.
_________________
Prof. K. Raman
Mumbai

[parthavi]

Thank you prof. Just after posting my message, I thought I had made a mistake in the chronology.

So, MM has used the interlude of a song of melancholy to a song of ecstasy with perfect fit.
_________________
P Rengaswami (9381409380)
MSV, Un isai kettaal puvi asainthaadum, idhu iraivan arul aagum.
http://msv-music.blogspot.in/

[Sai Saravanan]

Dear sirs,
The mix of two songs offered by Mr.Raghavendran is beautiful. These instances are perhaps inspirational, on the spot, kind of introduction by our master. The flow is always present in his mind, before his eyes, and he instantly derives a right blend and composes the song in the final stages. I do not know how to appreciate (forget deciphering a genius) the instantaneous flow of rhythm and melody from his mind! Amazing creations! Not at all sounding repetitive!!
Sai Saravanan

[Venkat]

Dear Mr. Raghavendran,
Anyone who has not heard these two songs will think this as a single song.
A wonderful analysis and observation and above all a wonderful mixing.
_________________
Meendum Santhippom Viraivil...
Regards,
Mahesh

[N Y MURALI]

Dear Mr. Parthavi,
There is also a similarity between the song 'kangale kangale' and the song
'malarukku thendral pgaiyaanaal' as both are the offshoot of a fragrance of raga 'bhagheshri'. The interesting feature is both are for the sober sequence but the difference is that theres is a change of gender perspective.

Interesting both the movie happened to be of the same year suggesting that MSV could have either offered both the tunes and one of that could have been approved for the first composition. He could have offered the remainder to the next which also could have been approved. Or the director himself would have asked for a similar tune as the first one as it could have gained popularity.

The contemporaries could throw more light.

N Y MURALI